Recap of Bubba Ray Dudley on Between the Ropes             by Richard Trionfo

This week Bubba Ray Dudley appeared in studio with Fritz, Dickerman, and Vito DeNucci on Between the Ropes to go into further detail about the issues that were discussed on The Buckethead show on Real Rock 101.1 as well as some new subjects. Bubba talks about the current situation with the WWE, what might be happening with the Dudley Boys in the future, the recent WWE releases, and other matters in the world of wrestling.

Bubba said that negotiations with the WWE came to an end. They were close on the number, but the Dudleys wanted a little raise after six years of loyal employment. The WWE wanted them to take a pay cut based on the current landscape. They would have to pay big money to keep the Dudleys, but who would they wrestle right now. Why invest in a million dollar sports car when you can only drive it once a year.

The announcement was surprising because they were close to a deal. They were ready to take the WWE deal. They were willing to be team players and try to get a few side things to make it better like pay per views or overseas tour. Then the deal was gone. Maybe they are thinking that once the tag team division improves, they can bring the Dudleys back.

When they knew they were going on hiatus, Vince asked them what they thought about ECW. They talked for about an hour to get some ideas. Bubba said that they aren’t talking about WCW. People want ECW to come back. Bubba said the ECW DVD would be a best seller, but Vince did not seem too confident that it would do so well. The pay per view was Rob Van Dam’s idea. He went to Vince and planted the seed in Vince’s head to do the ECW pay per view. He would think that if they did another show, it could be done in Philadelphia.

The contract expires on August 26, 2005, so they are still under contract with the WWE. They left the WWE on good terms. They have no hard feelings towards the WWE. They have talked to Vince by e-mail. In their six years, they had the greatest run of any tag team. They did more than Demolition or the Hart Foundation. They were not happy with the way the situation was handled, but it is water under the bridge. Bubba said that they volunteered to go down to OVW to work with MNM. Bubba is a big fan of Joey Matthews. They will be a good tag team even though they have a wannabe 3-D finish. Bubba is optimistic about the situation and does not think that you have seen the last of the Dudleys in the WWE. It will mean something when they come back.

If you are going to come back and make a mark, you do it right and that happened at the ECW pay per view. Bubba thought it was a great pay per view. It was not the most technically sound pay per view, but it was one of the most emotional pay per views. 3,000 screaming fans in New York would outdo 70,000 screaming fans in Houston any day. When they went on the air until they went off the air, everyone was on their feet and having the time of their lives. After they came to the ring for their match, the camera did not shoot Bubba during Sandman’s entrance because he was singing along with Enter Sandman. He wanted to be in the center of the ring with Sandman’s music playing because he knew what was going to happen. Steve Austin coming out was the icing on the cake because he was a part of ECW.

Television did the pay per view no justice. It was so much more incredible live because of all of the energy. There was a different feeling in the locker room, but he was able to be in the locker room with. He is more of a WWE guy because he has been in the WWE for 6 years while he spent 4 years in the WWE. It was like oil and water with the WWE guys in the locker room with the ECW guys.

Paul Heyman was foaming at the mouth during the pay per view. He wanted to get out there so badly to get things off his chest. It was like Paul sticking out his finger to the world telling everyone that this style would not be around if not for him. Bubba said that Van Dam took a lot of liberties when he got to speak at the pay per view.

ECW is Vince’s ‘whore’ and whenever he wants to ‘send his whore back on the street he will’. The pay per view made him a lot of money. It is a money maker. If you put it out there every week, it will never be the same. It needs to be special, maybe once a year. It will leave a good taste in everyone’s throat to have the experience.

Bubba was asked about what it was like to not have Shane Douglas, Raven, and Jerry Lynn. Whatever you want to say about Raven, he is a smart guy and he has one of the most over characters in wrestling. You can melt into his promos. Shane was a great champion, a great talker, and a great worker. Terry Funk is the godfather of ECW. Jerry Lynn is a great worker. Rob Van Dam and Jerry Lynn would have torn the house down if they could have worked the show. Hardcore Homecoming might have wanted some WWE guys. He heard that it did well and was a lot of fun.

Bubba does not know if any TNA guys were going to be used on the show because he was not involved in that part. He had an idea what was going on at the show. They went out and gave everyone the icing on the cake and the violence that they wanted to see. Bubba joked that Sandman cannot wrestle and wrestling Dreamer is like rolling a walrus up a hill in molasses.

The ECW pay per view light a fire under the WWE. He knows what the boys can do when they want to. They did not want to be outdone by an ECW product and they worked their asses off. Every time you watch Smackdown and Raw, you see the increased work rate.

Bubba talked about the Mike Awesome/Masato Tanaka match and it was a great match because of their chemistry. It was probably the most exciting match of the night. However, did they get a job with the WWE after the match? Bubba laughed harder after every table broke during that match. Everyone who saw that match before knew what to expect, but many of the WWE wrestlers were shocked at what they were doing in the ring.

Bradshaw is a good friend of his. People came up to him and asked him about using tables. He had no problem because they were not the first and will not be the last. It wouldn’t be hard to top the lighter fluid. Dreamer smelled like charred walrus flesh.

They were contacted by a writer and said that they were ready to fire them up after the ECW pay per view. They discussed who they were going to work with. It seemed like they realized that they did not have the right teams to work with the Dudleys at the money they are going to pay them. He expects to see a spark in the tag team scene because the teams are on the same level. There are no teams for the Dudleys to draw real money with right now. Every time a new team was put together, they would have to be put in with the Dudleys. Either they would have to wrestle at a lower level to their opponents or they would need to destroy the team.

Tag team wrestling has never been a priority of the WWE. When Vince came across the Hardys and Edge and Christian and got lucky. When the Dudleys came in, Vince ‘stepped in crap’ because he had three teams that worked well together. He had an opportunity to make money and did it for two and a half years. Teams that start in the business today don’t appear to want to swallow their pride and be part of a tag team.

On September 10, 2005, The Dudleys will face The Midnight Express (Dennis Condrey and Bobby Eaton) in Davie, Florida for the first time. They might get outwrestled by the Midnight Express, but they will out brawl them. He talked about working at Wrestle Reunion 2 and is really excited to meet a lot of the wrestlers. Bruno Sammartino is a wrestling god and Bubba is looking forward to meeting him for the first time. They will be working Matt Hardy and Rhino at Wrestle Reunion and looks forward to giving Rhino a 3-D. There are a lot of dream matches out there for the Dudleys if they are not in the WWE. It is a nice bubble in the WWE, but there is an entire world out there.

He does not understand why there is a problem. He always wanted to be in a tag team. He does not want to be the world champion; he wanted to be the most successful tag team ever. He thinks they are near the top, but not the best. They have done what it takes to get up there. Tag team wrestling is more fun than singles matches. One of the last great matches they had was with Rob Van Dam and Booker T before they went to Smackdown. He talks about how Booker T said that if they wanted to do a final match as Harlem Heat, he wanted to face the Dudleys.

He noticed the shift with the tag team division when they had the draft when Vince told them that they wanted to split the Dudleys. There are teams that you don’t want to see split up. They pay to see the Dudleys as a team, not Bubba and D-Von in singles matches. Bubba asked if that is what they wanted. Vince said that if it didn’t work, he could always put them back together. When they got back together, Madison Square Garden exploded from the reunion.

It was Bubba and D-Von’s idea to go to Ohio Valley Wrestling. Vince asked them when they wanted to come back. Bubba said that they did not want to go on vacation, it was Vince’s idea. They wanted to come back when Vince is able to develop tag teams to help make the division better. They wanted to help develop tag teams. They went down to work with MNM. Cornette was helping to get them over, and they had a match with the Dudleys. The next week, MNM were on Smackdown after the tape was sent to the WWE.

TNA appears to be investing in tag teams. Tag team wrestling has always been exciting. He was a huge fan of the Road Warriors. Even though you see one match, you have seen them all, but it was so exciting to watch them. Bubba talks about the British Bulldogs and other great tag teams of the 1980s and 1990s.

They are nine time WWE, eight time ECW, and one time WCW tag team champions. They wanted to wrestle the Road Warriors, but they wrestled Rob Van Dam and Kane instead. The Dudleys versus the Road Warriors might not have been a great match, but the build up would have been better than the match. The greatest tag team versus the most decorated tag team. Unfortunately Hawk passed away. They were the most over tag team in the world. He takes his hat off to the person who decided to bring back Animal. When asked if he wanted to see the Dudleys face Heidenreich and Animal and Bubba was speechless. Bubba says that Heidenreich is a nice guy.

They talked about the transition from ECW to the WWE and mentioned the situation when The Public Enemy left ECW and came to the WWE because they gave people a bad taste in their mouth. Ron Simmons and Bradshaw are the first people you are fed to first when you come into the company. If you pass that test, you get to Taker. They had to hit the APA with 2x4s. They could be safe and suffer in the future or take it out on them and live with what happens next. Ron Simmons screamed things in Ebonics that neither he nor D-Von could understand. They were being interviewed in the back with Simmons and Bradshaw waiting to pounce. The entire locker room was surrounding the set, waiting to see what happened when Simmons and Bradshaw returned the favor and they took it from both men as soon as the red light went on. That is how they got over on their first night.

The WWE thought the Dudleys would become monster heels by putting women through tables. Bubba told them that it would make them the biggest baby faces. The first time they did it was in Philadelphia. Bubba said that Mae Young was the ‘toughest man he knows’. After Bubba power bombed Mae in the ring through a table. She slammed Mae gingerly in the ring. She grabbed his wrist harder than Lou Thesz ever could and she told Bubba if he is going to slam her, slam her like one of the boys. She took a powerbomb off a 15 foot stage through tables as well. Mae went to Vince and wanted to be power bombed off the top of the cage. Mae and Moolah are great women and great to work with.

Trish Stratus is a trooper because when the feud with T&A was blown off, she had to go through a table. Bubba was bleeding and she kissed him, not caring about the blood. Trish is a tough person. She has come a long way from fitness model to a good women’s wrestler. She gets bruised up and takes a lot of bumps on her face.

A TLC match is the most difficult match to put together because you had six to eight men in the match. Everyone needs to know the entire match backwards and forward because if someone forgets what to do or gets hurt, the match will get screwed up. You cannot change things around on the fly. He got bulldogged off a ten foot ladder by Jericho in Las Vegas. He landed on his head and was out cold. He didn’t remember a thing, but Jericho got him through the match. Jericho told Bubba to give Christian a BubbaBomb, and Bubba asked how. Then he was told to take the Van Daminator, and he didn’t know who Van Dam was. He was told to back drop Jeff Hardy, and did not know who Jeff was. When he watched the match again, he did not remember the match, but he hit every spot. It is a testament to anyone who has been in a TLC match. Jeff has been the star of so many TLC matches and Jeff had the least amount of input. They would plan Jeff’s stuff first and then book everything around Jeff. Nobody can ever take away what the Dudleys, the Hardys, and Edge and Christian have done. Every TLC match has been topped. Everyone knew what the final fall would be for each team. He thought it would be great if someone hung up there with Jeff. They told D-Von to do it, and he was afraid of heights. He pointed out how they usually had a women’s match follow the TLC matches.

Bubba was in the hospital after a concussion and he did not know that his mother had died. He was told almost 40 times and cried every time he was told that. He only knew his address and kept repeating it. He didn’t even know that he was engaged at the time.

They wanted to lower the bar a little because ECW blew it away. Vince let the guys go crazy as a result and there was great wrestling for a while. However, guys were getting their necks broken. They needed to take it easy and work smarter and tell a good story. When it does not happen as much, it means more. The Hell in a Cell match between Hunter and Batista worked because they made the weapons mean something. Psychology is the most important thing in wrestling. Bubba mentions that Taz and Sabu was built for a year and never touched. If done right, stories can be drawn out.

When you come out of a time with people like the Rock, Steve Austin, Taker, Mick Foley who are so over and you have fewer around with that reaction, you are begging for the next superstar. They are doing a good job with Cena and Batista now. They might be able to do a better job, but you have television twice a week. Randy Orton was discussed and said that the spot that people expected for Orton and Hunter at Wrestlemania was supposed to be for Batista. Orton is better suited for a heel. They have the best intentions to get guys over, but things could be missed. They look at a bad rating when someone is trying to get over and might drop things. It is a combination of ratings and audience reaction. If the WWE went to an old school mentality for drawing out storylines, things could be better.

Talk moved on to working for TNA and becoming NWA tag team champions. TNA is the best possible thing for pro wrestling. They are competition. They are getting better every week. It is growing like ECW. ECW used to be on Sunshine Network at 2:00 a.m. If they play their cards right, they will get better. They have a good tag team scene. He has heard from a lot of people who want to see the Dudleys in TNA. If the people at TNA are interested in talking to the Dudleys they live around the corner from where TNA tapes their shows. If you want the rainbow, you have to deal with the rain. They need to overcome any hurdles that a start up company needs to do.

They have gotten calls from all over the world to work for them, and Bubba and D-Von are looking for the best opportunity to become the best performers. It does not have to be the most money. The slightest bit of competition is good for the industry. Vince is at his best when his back is up against the wall. Nobody comes out swinging like Vince. He wishes TNA the best for the wrestling industry and wrestling fans. Bubba does not know if Vince is concerned about TNA right now. He will have to take notice if they get a Monday night at 9:00 p.m. time slot.

Bubba looks forward to wrestling for 20 to 30 minutes every night. They have become stale in the ring because they have not had experienced people to wrestling in the ring. They want to be in the ring with people who will push them. He looks forward to working with the Midnight Express because he will learn that night. He wants to face teams where they do things they have never done again. Bubba wants to get in the ring with the Funks. Let D-Von get stretched by Dory and then see himself getting beaten up by Terry. He does not thing you will ever see a ‘Dudleys’ promo because there are kids in the audience. ‘Hardcore and Extreme’ are the ‘mother and father’ of Attitude. The hosts talked about a show in Orlando where it got a little wild at an ECW show in Orlando. There is no bad heat. When people are sitting in the parking lot at 2:00 a.m. to spit on your car or try to stab you, you are doing something right. That is what the Dudleys did the best. He has done promos that made people’s skin crawl. ECW was the most real pro wrestling you will see.

Creative tries very hard and they are under a lot of pressure to have compelling wrestling every week. If Bubba made the decision about booking and gave them the ‘pencil’, he would put in Arn Anderson, Michael Hayes, and Pat Patterson’s hands. Pat Patterson is one of the smartest minds in wrestling. He would have people who know wrestling in creative. You need a wrestling mind to put together pro wrestling. There are people who want to be Paul Heyman, but they hang from Paul Heyman’s jock. Paul Heyman is an evil genius. Paul and Vince are the two smartest men in wrestling history. Paul created the monster and Vince made a lot of money with it. Paul and Vince are like two magnets that can only get as close as science will let them. They probably have a mutual respect, but Paul is a difficult man to deal with because of his passion. He will fight to the death over the smallest aspect of a match while Vince will let it go if it is too small.

Bubba was asked about what could be in store for Paul Heyman, but he does not know. If TNA asked Paul Heyman to take things and run with it with money behind him. Jeff Jarrett has a good creative mind, as well as Shane Douglas and Scott D’Amore. Paul Heyman is a different animal. Shane knows what Paul can do. Nobody has taken chicken crap and turned it into chicken salad quicker than Paul Heyman. The Dudleys were a comedy routine, but then he saw more than a comedy routine. It became something special. Paul would need complete creative control and Bubba does not know if anyone would give it to him. Paul would need to create something different if he was going to start a new company, not another ECW. Bubba would love to see Paul with Quest Wrestling. He can accentuate the positives and hide the weaknesses.

Johnny Ace has been put in one of the toughest positions because he only answers to Vince McMahon. Johnny was a good wrestling mind and a good finish guy. They could come up with a finish in about five minutes. They have gone head-to-head and clashed at times, but they have also agreed about some things.

Bubba suggested that despite what a lot of people like to say on the internet that maybe Hunter and Stephanie love each other, not a situation where Hunter is doing this for power. It will roll off Hunter’s back. Bubba never had a problem with Hunter. His second year in the WWE, Hunter pulled Bubba to the side to talk to him about an incident. Bubba does not know if Hunter ever said anything behind his back or said anything about him. He cannot say anything bad about Hunter. Hunter has been the champion because he puts asses in the seats. He does something to get people to talk about him. Bubba brought up the question of whether the WWE will ever let someone not created by the WWE get over a WWE talent. There are plenty of people that Bubba does not like in the business, but unless they are brought up, he is not going to talk about them.

They talked about ‘Black Wednesday’. That annoyed Bubba and D-Von because they were lumped in with everyone who got released. It is not that they are better than those people. The WWE could have waited until the end of their contract time because they were not fired. They have tried to done right by the company and expected to be held in higher regard. He did not feel that being called at 9:30 p.m. on a Tuesday night was the right thing, instead of during business hours. What if D-Von was with his family when he got the call?

He was not shocked by any of the releases because they were probably viewed as dead weight by the company or they were not going to be used properly if they stayed. Being released might be the best thing that could happen to them. Charlie Haas is a phenomenal wrestler and with some personality, he will be a competent pro wrestler. The best entertainer in that group to be released was Jimmy Yang.

Bubba is not a big internet guy, but he said that it appears to be growing. It looks like WWE.com is trying to get scoops before other sites do. D-Von didn’t want to talk to WWE.com because it was so soon after the announcement. Bubba called back right away, but they did not follow up the call. It is business and it happens every day in all businesses.

Bubba restated that he likes what they are doing with Cena and Batista because they are bringing them along slowly every week. The Diva Search is on television because people stop to watch it. Vince is not putting 't & a' on television for any other reason that people will watch it. Wrestling does not have to be a cycle. It comes along when every performer comes along. If there is a Rock, Hunter, Cactus Jack, Steve Austin type wrestler it will come back. Cena’s charisma and persona outshines his in ring work. However, Hulk Hogan and Warrior were the same. Perception is reality. People perceive Cena as a superstar.

Promoters who want to book the Dudleys for shows can e-mail requests to [email protected]. It is not to contact Bubba or D-Von. Instead of contacting Bubba or D-Von, you will be telling their agent. He assures his fans that they are going to 3-D more people and put more women through tables. If you are a promoter, feel free to contact that address. The Dudleys will not come cheap and they will work for the reputable companies and people who will do the right thing. They appreciate the offers and would love to do every show.

Bubba says that independent wrestling is getting big, and Bubba talks about the talent in ROH. Bubba brings up Quest Pro Wrestling (www.questprowrestling.com) and says to look out for this promotion. They will be mixing a lot of talent and have the best independent talent along with the people who have been recently released from the WWE.

He was asked about morale in the locker room. Bubba mentions that he has not been in a locker room in nine months. He never had any problems because he never let anything get him down. If he or D-Von had a problem, he would confront them instead of saying things behind their back. He will say what he wants and figures that it is better than talking about someone behind their backs. There are politics everywhere, even at Dunkin’ Donuts. Bubba joked that Tommy Dreamer loves Dunkin’ Donuts.

Bubba talked about an ECW show in Kissimmee when Dreamer sat down in the ring and the chair broke. Bubba joked that Dreamer was at the top of the list for floatation devices with Delta Airlines.

Between the Ropes airs every Wednesday from 10:00 p.m. until Midnight on 740 The Team in Orlando, Florida with hosts Brian Fritz, Dickerman, and Vito DeNucci. Check out www.betweentheropes.com to listen to the live stream of the show every week. Archives of past interviews with Paul Heyman, Mike Tenay, Terry Funk, A.J. Styles, Rob Van Dam, Tully Blanchard, Mick Foley, Ric Flair, Matt Hardy, Jerry Lawler, Bobby Heenan, Steve Corino, Shane Douglas, Elix Skipper, Harley Race, Bubba Ray Dudley, and many more people in the world of professional wrestling can also be found on www.betweentheropes.com.